Talk:National Rifle Association
"The number of gun homicides in the United States is over 11,000 per year (about 3.8 per 100,000 population). The UK (which has 1/5th the population of the USA) averages only about 100 gun homicides per year (about 0.16 per 100,000), and most of the other industrialized countries have a similiar low rate of gun homicides compared to the USA. This has led many people to criticize the NRA for its pro-gun lobbying (including filmmaker and NRA member Michael Moore in his film Bowling for Columbine). Others have countered by stating the fact that the vast majority of gun homicides in America are commited by Blacks and Hispanics (white Americans have a gun-homicide rate only slightly higher than Western European countries, and actually lower than Eastern European countries). Also stating that if America is looking to drastically cut down its number of gun homicides, they should work to improve the lot of Black and Hispanic Americans, and not ban or severely limit access to guns"
I find this paragraph somewhat racist. I think it should worded more carefully--User: palexisls
While it is apparently true that Michael Moore is an NRA member, it's slightly misleading in this context. He joined the NRA as part of his campaign against them. The way this article mentioned the fact, it suggested that Moore might be a supporter of the general goals of the organization, while critical in some aspects. That's not right. --User:Jimbo Wales
- Well, according to Michael Moore, he joined the NRA as a teenage junior member and won the NRA Marksman Award back then. Are you implying that he is a mole infiltrating the NRA since then?--User:Kchishol1970
Does Charlton Heston really run the NRA, or is he more of a PR spokesman serving at the whim of the elected board and/or the executive vice president Wayne LaPierre? (some organizations have a figurehead as the titular leader, ya know)
--Ed Poor
- A president is a president. Minor edit. --User:LenBudney
- Well, is it really up to the Wiki to make that distinction? --Dante Alighieri
- Good searching, Ed! Now I know. --Dante Alighieri
NRA "victories"?????
Other than the flood of states going to "shall-issue CCW licences" and some progress towards stopping the predatory lawsuits from gun-haters against the lawful firearms industry, what other "victories" has the NRA had? As far as I can tell, the most the NRA has managed to do is to somewhat slow-down the assaults from the gun-haters lobby. I can't think of a single positive law protecting individual firearms rights the NRA has managed to get enacted which actually stayed in-place and functioning to benefit lawful gun-owners. Playing a dragging boat-anchor against the juggernaught of gun-haters is better than nothing, but it's certainly not a "victory". Can anyone give me some examples of real NRA "victories"???
I didn't feel it was accurate to simply state that the "NRA is the oldest civil rights organization"; the only people I've ever heard use the phrase are NRA leaders, writings, etc. Since most people think of minority rights when they hear "civil rights", calling the NRA a civil rights group without qualification might be a little misleading. One compromise might be to call them a "civil liberties group"? Or something. Needs more thought. Suggestions, anyone? Meelar 20:20, Dec 8, 2003
I think it's accurate: besides, aren't gun owners a minority as well?
I guess I should have been more clear. When people hear civil rights, they think "ethnic minority", i.e. blacks, Hispanics, etc. In addition, I've seen that phrase, verbatim, in their publications. I've never heard anyone else use it to describe them. It seems pretty clearly biased. It'd be great if you'd register, so I could put an anonymous name to a post--we'd love to have your contributions. Thanks, Meelar 00:38, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
Not necessarily. The phrase "Civil Rights" includes many rights that have nothing to do with race or ethnicity. For example, the right to assocation, the right to speech, the right to practice one's religion. The right to own a firearm can be seen as a "civil right" in this sense, if such right is granted by the US Constitution.
The content about how many of the NRA's founders fought on the side of the union was basically irrelevant--it sounded as if the author had something to prove, more than anything. I took it out. Meelar 07:41, 11 Mar 2004 (UTC)
Political Cartoon in The Palm Beach Newspaper
Please bear with me as I am new to this forum. The providence Journal ran a political cartoon in it's tuesday morning paper which infuriated me. I couldn't read the name of the cartoonist but what he wrote was apalling. The headline was "Wake UP AMERICA" there was a drawing of a man called Eugene Dillpond, he was purported to be the originator of the NRA and that it was a subversive socialist organization. Supposedly supported by Nikita Kruschov (sic). the jist of the text was that that it was started to get the names of all the gun owners in the US and track them by their dues which would be mailed in. It went on to say that the CIA has said that the NRA plans to turn over the names of those same gun owners to any invading forces. How's that for a bunch of bull. I'd like to know if anyone has seen this and can comment on it. I can find no published account of anyone going by the name Eugene Dillpond. Is this an effort to reduce our ranks by scare tactics? If it is, I hope everyone is aware of this and will respond to it accordingly. At the time of this writing, I was not looking at the cartoon and was working from memory, since then, I have rediscovered it and will now post it verbatim:
WAKE UP AMERICA! BEFORE IT'S TOO LATE! The National Rifle Association was actually founded in 1871 by radical leftist Eugene Dillpond. Dillpond was part of a carefully concocted scheme to get US gun owners to reveal their whereabouts by mailing in dues. Through the generations, the NRA has served as a front for socialist misfits ( Nikita Khrushchev was a collaborator). To this day, the CIA says, the group plans to turn over it's list of gun owners to invading forces. The original cartoon was drawn by WRIGHT and printed in the Palm Beach Post. I assume that this is the Palm Beach Florida paper.
The drawing of this character appears to be legitmate at first glance. Wearing period correct clothing with a derby atop his head, upright collar and tie. As I mentioned, I can find no mention of this individual anywhere.
Oldest Civil Rights group 2.0
I didn't feel it was accurate to simply state that the "NRA is the oldest civil rights organization"; the only people I've ever heard use the phrase are NRA leaders, writings, etc. Since most people think of minority rights when they hear "civil rights", calling the NRA a civil rights group without qualification might be a little misleading. One compromise might be to call them a "civil liberties group"? Or something. Needs more thought. Suggestions, anyone? Meelar 20:41, 24 May 2004 (UTC)
I don't know if they're the oldest group, but certainly those who believe in the personal right to own a gun base it on the 2nd ammendment from the Bill of Rights, so it's certainly accurately called a civil right. Civil rights go much further than simply talking about prejudice, they cover things like freedom of speech, freedom of assembly, freedom of religion, all of which are accurately called civil rights. One way to handle this in the article is to say something like "They refer to themselves a civil rights organization based on their belief that gun ownership is a civil right" or something similar that hopefully doesn't have prejudicial overtones. Arthurrh 21:56, 25 Jun 2004 (UTC)
- Well, right now we've got "They refer to themselves as the oldest civil rights group in the U.S." I agree, your suggestion is more clear. I'll put it in. Nice work, and welcome to Wikipedia. Best wishes, [[User:Meelar|Meelar (talk)]] 22:39, 25 Jun 2004 (UTC)
Rights and Responsibilities
The ownership of guns in isolation cannot be shown to increase the incidences of violence. Amongst other countries, Switzerland is often used as an example where guns are ubiquitous but violent crime is not. It must be therefore a combination of gun ownership with various cultural or socio-economic factors that are to blame for the level of gun crime in the US. IMO The National Rifle association would find it in their favour in the long run to focus on what needs to be done in respect to the latter to ensure wider gun ownership can continue without what is causing the problems rather than ranting on about constitutional rights without addressing the repsonsibilities that such rights carry Dainamo 17:42, 21 Aug 2004 (UTC)
Opinion Polls
Is it really proper to make mention to opinion polls in this listing without providing some kind of evidence that the numbers mentioned are accurate or that there aren't contradictory polls? --Pghtechguy
The Big Disparity
I find this paragraph somewhat out of place - it belongs in a general article about gun ownership, rather than a specific article about an organization. Does anyone agre, and know of a suitable place to move it?--Pmeisel 18:39, 30 Jan 2005 (UTC)