User talk:Xandar: Difference between revisions

Archive 1 April 2006 – June 2008 Archive 2 July 2008 – December 2009

William of York

Wonderful additions, but you've only put in page numbers, what work are you using for those references please? Ealdgyth - Talk 01:46, 18 December 2009 (UTC)

"St William of York," by Christopher Norton (2006). I was going to fill in the details later. Xandar 02:08, 18 December 2009 (UTC)

I thought it might be, it's been sitting on my shelf for a little bit waiting for me to actually add details in. Glad to see someone doing it. I just try to keep the article pretty spiffy since it's a GA, that's all. Ealdgyth - Talk 02:14, 18 December 2009 (UTC)

I moved the following post from User:Nancy Danielson which was erroneously posted on Xandar's userpage [1].NancyHeise ^talk 04:24, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

Thank you. Nancy D.

Archived your talk page

Xandar, just revert me if you prefer. Your talk page covered a year and a half of conversations I hope you don't mind. Merry Christmas! NancyHeise ^talk 03:56, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

Economic history of China (pre-1911) FAC

I noticed you have participated several China-related FAC's and seem to have some expertise in this area. Can you give me some input at the FAC? Thank you.Teeninvestor (talk) 03:08, 22 December 2009 (UTC)

i'll try and have a look at this, but it may take a day or two in the lead-up to Christmas. However I don't really claim expertise in this area. I participated in the other FACs more in terms of copyediting issues and making sure that I, as a NON-expert, could understand what the articles were saying and that the historic narrative was clear and consistent. Xandar 01:21, 23 December 2009 (UTC)

Christmas

Hi, merry Christmas to you and yours. I'm wondering if you could come and join recent discussion at Talk:Christmas, where there is a dispute about the leading sentence. I am in favor of keeping the opening as "Christmas is a Christian holiday commemorating the birth of Jesus", but another user has insisted on changing this to "Christmas is a holiday that, in Christianity, commemorates the birth of Jesus". Please voice your opinion about which you prefer (or any alternatives) at the talk page. Thanks for your participation in this. — CIS ^(talk | stalk) 19:00, 24 December 2009 (UTC)

Merry Christmas, History2007 (talk) 20:19, 24 December 2009 (UTC)

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year Xandar! NancyHeise ^talk 07:01, 11 January 2010 (UTC)

WikiProject Catholicism

Hello, I haven't been feeling well for the past few weeks and so I can't help with the project right now. I have some ideas for articles (not all strictly Catholic) but those will have to wait. LovesMacs (talk) 18:58, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Talk:Clerical child abuse in the Middle Ages

Most of the "material" in this "article" is made up of innuendo and supposition. I fear that it borders very much on being sectional polemic and original research. As far as I can see, there is not one solid fact concerning the alleged subject-matter. It seems like a speedy deletion to me. Xandar 00:10, 17 January 2010 (UTC)

There have been whole books written on the subject, so it's more than just innuendo. Of course, if you're not willing to collaborate on the article and just want to complain that the subject is taboo for some people, that's an entirely different matter that should be discussed separately. ADM (talk) 00:43, 17 January 2010 (UTC)

As far as I can see one, fringe, work has been written on the subject, by people who make money out of abuse cases. This sort of fringe opinion is NOT the basis for an article, and if it were, it would have to be far more balanced than the amalgamation of innuendo produced so far. This is a fringe subject with absolutely zero actual solid information - and just a lot of innuendoes based on laws condemning whole masses of actions. Wikipedia is not the place for pushing fringe POV and catholic-bashing propaganda. Xandar 00:52, 17 January 2010 (UTC)

The Catholic Church itself has ackowledged that there were many abuse cases in the Middle Ages. In fact, during that time, it served as its own police force and had priests write down reports about who was committing what types of abuses. You can easily understand what was going on when you read the works of people like Peter Damian and Gregory VII. ADM (talk) 00:58, 17 January 2010 (UTC)

I don't think the Church has stated this. I don't doubt that there were cases of abuse in the Middle Ages, in the Church and elsewhere, and in the various cultures of antiquity. It is most likely that child abuse has gone on since the stone age. It is one of humanity's perversions. However what the present material proves, if anything, is that the Church was perhaps the only historic institution that legislated against and condemned the problem. However, instead, the article and its fringe sources try to seive through the few historical documents and falsely infer that a) Catholicism was prone to sexual abuse, because it legislated against it, and b) that therefore Catholics have always been (for some mysterious reason) more involved in sexual abuse than anyone else. It is this latter unproven claim that the article seems to be intending to bolster through inference and innuendo. Xandar 01:32, 17 January 2010 (UTC)

I meant to write this entry as a complement to the article pederasty in the Renaissance, which already has reliable sources. It is possible to review the style and remove certain POV issues, but I will not deny that pederasty existed quite a bit in the Middle Ages, i.e. within Latin Christendom. In fact, there is really no other way around it, when you consider the significant role that the clergy played throughout history, in all aspects of social life, including marriage and the various types of ordained and un-ordnained sexuality. It has to be included somehow in order to improve the category:history of pederasty.

I am also ready to gather additional material about child abuse in the history of other religions, such as Eastern Orthodoxy, Protestantism, Judaism and Islam, if this will seem less discriminatory. Regarding the causes of child abuse, I am in agreement that it has nothing to do with celibacy in particular, but that it has much to do with the fact that clergy tend to be homosocial, i.e. if they were kept isolated in monastic cloisters instead of urban parishes, this would never happen as much, because they would not be constantly surrounded by other males, like some sort of men's club that needs its own type of sexual recruitment.

ADM (talk)

All very well, but this homosociality business is just a theory. I think figures show that the majority of clerical child abuse consists of homosexual-linked relations between religious males and boys in their teens. It is also very probable that historically the celibate priesthood has for various reasons been an attractive profession to those with homosexual leanings. But I don't think there's convincing evidence, that with (the possible exception of the latter form of abuse), abuse is more prominent within the priesthood than elsewhere. As far as I can see, child abuse in general has been seen as MORE likely to occur in active heterosexual and family circumstances than elsewhere. Also there is the familiar story of "Mr X does Y, it's local news, Rev X does Y, it's major national news", which distorts reporting and perception. So a per-se link between child abuse and clergy is highly speculative and based on projection back of false assumptions. I don't think that we are ever going to get much in the way of figures for non-clerical medieval child abuse, which is probably one of history's most under-reported crimes. Xandar 11:54, 17 January 2010 (UTC)

Christmas

Hi there. Noted your vast knowledge of theology (mine is somewhat limited) and your contributions to the topic hence why i'm messaging. On the Christmas article, if you could ensure that any contentious ammendments are veted... one such being...Although a Christian holiday... changed to...Although most consider this to be a Christian holiday. This doesnt sit right. Thanks. Bill.Roache - Talk 22:14, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

Catholic Church and AIDS

Ugh. What a horrid article that was. I have performed some radical surgery on it. Please take a look and tell me what you think. My next step will be to add in the stuff about Ed Green. --Richard S (talk) 17:18, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

This is poor logic, I find. If we want to know about Jewish views on anything, we would cite a list of responsas from rabbis, and that would presumably correspond to the sect's views. These Cardinals are no different from chief rabbis, in that they present the opinions or philosophies of their peculiar religious group, which tend to build a type of consensus. It is a type of collegiality or conciliarity, if you like. Cf concept of ordinary magisterium. ADM (talk) 21:53, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

Arbitration notice

You are involved in a recently-filed request for arbitration. Please review the request at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests#Catholic Church and, if you wish to do so, enter your statement and any other material you wish to submit to the Arbitration Committee. Additionally, the following resources may be of use—

• Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests#Requests for Arbitration;
• Wikipedia:Arbitration guide.

Thanks,. Please add others to the party list if you think it is necessary. Karanacs (talk) 19:48, 22 February 2010 (UTC)