Talk:Slovak noble families - Revision history

Borsoka: /* Merge */ new section

2008-08-19T10:20:30Z

Merge: new section

← Previous revision		Revision as of 10:20, 19 August 2008
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	:::Ahoj. And what then? --[[User:Koppany\|Koppany]] ([[User talk:Koppany\|talk]]) 04:35, 6 March 2008 (UTC)		:::Ahoj. And what then? --[[User:Koppany\|Koppany]] ([[User talk:Koppany\|talk]]) 04:35, 6 March 2008 (UTC)
	:: Just change the title of this page for: Hungarian noble families with slovakian origin. Thats it. I hope that everyone will be happy then. maybe. --[[User:Sibenicky\|Sibenicky]] ([[User talk:Sibenicky\|talk]]) 08:03, 7 March 2008 (UTC)		:: Just change the title of this page for: Hungarian noble families with slovakian origin. Thats it. I hope that everyone will be happy then. maybe. --[[User:Sibenicky\|Sibenicky]] ([[User talk:Sibenicky\|talk]]) 08:03, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

			== Merge ==

			The public law of Slovakia has never accepted the existence of nobility, because Slovakia was established as a republic. All the noble families who lived or have been living in the territory of present day Slovakia were members of the nobility of the Kingdom of Hungary. Therefore the article [[Nobility in the Kingdom of Hungary]] could describes all the features of the nobility independently of their origin, because the public law of the kingdom did not differentiate its nobility based on its nationality. [[User:Borsoka\|Borsoka]] ([[User talk:Borsoka\|talk]]) 10:20, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

Sibenicky: message

2008-03-07T08:03:33Z

message

← Previous revision		Revision as of 08:03, 7 March 2008
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	:::Ahoj. And what then? --[[User:Koppany\|Koppany]] ([[User talk:Koppany\|talk]]) 04:35, 6 March 2008 (UTC)		:::Ahoj. And what then? --[[User:Koppany\|Koppany]] ([[User talk:Koppany\|talk]]) 04:35, 6 March 2008 (UTC)
			:: Just change the title of this page for: Hungarian noble families with slovakian origin. Thats it. I hope that everyone will be happy then. maybe. --[[User:Sibenicky\|Sibenicky]] ([[User talk:Sibenicky\|talk]]) 08:03, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

Koppany at 04:35, 6 March 2008

2008-03-06T04:35:13Z

← Previous revision		Revision as of 04:35, 6 March 2008
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	:: Hello guys, everything OK? Slovakia was established from January 1, 1993 (1991???) see [[Slovakia]] and SLOVAK has meaning like ENGLISHMAN and SLOVAKIAN has meaning like ENGLISH. Have a nice day :-) --[[User:Sibenicky\|Sibenicky]] ([[User talk:Sibenicky\|talk]]) 13:22, 3 March 2008 (UTC)		:: Hello guys, everything OK? Slovakia was established from January 1, 1993 (1991???) see [[Slovakia]] and SLOVAK has meaning like ENGLISHMAN and SLOVAKIAN has meaning like ENGLISH. Have a nice day :-) --[[User:Sibenicky\|Sibenicky]] ([[User talk:Sibenicky\|talk]]) 13:22, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

			:::Ahoj. And what then? --[[User:Koppany\|Koppany]] ([[User talk:Koppany\|talk]]) 04:35, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

Sibenicky: WHAT?

2008-03-03T13:22:27Z

WHAT?

← Previous revision		Revision as of 13:22, 3 March 2008
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	:: See I have tried to present the same argument to these Slovak nationalists to no avail. There are many articles in the English wikipedia that need objective cleanup (just take a look at articles dealing with Hungarian historical figures like Benyovszky or Jedlik Ányos and you will get my point). Oversized Slovak national consciousness has clearly no place in an English encyclopedia. [[User:Árpád\|Árpád]] 07:15, 27 January 2007 (UTC)		:: See I have tried to present the same argument to these Slovak nationalists to no avail. There are many articles in the English wikipedia that need objective cleanup (just take a look at articles dealing with Hungarian historical figures like Benyovszky or Jedlik Ányos and you will get my point). Oversized Slovak national consciousness has clearly no place in an English encyclopedia. [[User:Árpád\|Árpád]] 07:15, 27 January 2007 (UTC)

			:: Hello guys, everything OK? Slovakia was established from January 1, 1993 (1991???) see [[Slovakia]] and SLOVAK has meaning like ENGLISHMAN and SLOVAKIAN has meaning like ENGLISH. Have a nice day :-) --[[User:Sibenicky\|Sibenicky]] ([[User talk:Sibenicky\|talk]]) 13:22, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

Árpád: /* What is this supposed to mean? */

2007-01-27T07:15:20Z

What is this supposed to mean?

← Previous revision		Revision as of 07:15, 27 January 2007
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	''"Slovak - adj. Of or relating to Slovakia or its people, language, or culture."'' Slovakia exists since 1991. If you want, we can say between 1938-45 and since 1991. It can not be connected to a that time non existed country, wich was BTW that time was called as Upper Hungary, or Highlands. This is a creation. Maybe read again what I wrote a bit upper. This page can not be a territorial list, max an ethnic one, I changed its tontent to fit for this. It is funny too, since there's no [[Essexian noble families]], but [[English noble families]] Not to mention that some of them had nothing to do with the culture or the ppl (ok, except their peasants and employees), just lived there, or had lands there. OFF:And we know, that nobles very very barely mixed with ppl of lower rank, and those kids were not granted to enter the nobility. --[[User:VinceB\|Vince]] <sup>[[user talk:VinceB\|hey, yo!]] :-)</sup> 18:45, 4 January 2007 (UTC)		''"Slovak - adj. Of or relating to Slovakia or its people, language, or culture."'' Slovakia exists since 1991. If you want, we can say between 1938-45 and since 1991. It can not be connected to a that time non existed country, wich was BTW that time was called as Upper Hungary, or Highlands. This is a creation. Maybe read again what I wrote a bit upper. This page can not be a territorial list, max an ethnic one, I changed its tontent to fit for this. It is funny too, since there's no [[Essexian noble families]], but [[English noble families]] Not to mention that some of them had nothing to do with the culture or the ppl (ok, except their peasants and employees), just lived there, or had lands there. OFF:And we know, that nobles very very barely mixed with ppl of lower rank, and those kids were not granted to enter the nobility. --[[User:VinceB\|Vince]] <sup>[[user talk:VinceB\|hey, yo!]] :-)</sup> 18:45, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

			:: See I have tried to present the same argument to these Slovak nationalists to no avail. There are many articles in the English wikipedia that need objective cleanup (just take a look at articles dealing with Hungarian historical figures like Benyovszky or Jedlik Ányos and you will get my point). Oversized Slovak national consciousness has clearly no place in an English encyclopedia. [[User:Árpád\|Árpád]] 07:15, 27 January 2007 (UTC)

VinceB: /* What is this supposed to mean? */

2007-01-04T18:45:56Z

What is this supposed to mean?

← Previous revision		Revision as of 18:45, 4 January 2007
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	::"Slovak - adj. Of or relating to Slovakia or its people, language, or culture."		::"Slovak - adj. Of or relating to Slovakia or its people, language, or culture."
	::The words "Slovak" and "Slovakian" are synonyms and their use in the article's name does not necessarily imply ethnicity (as I explained in the article's lead). Compare with similar adjectives, such as "French" (i.e. "Of, relating to, or characteristic of France or its people or culture."). In the category French nobility, you can find nobles who died before France was even created as well as nobles of German or Catalan ethnicity. Why? Because the word "French" relates to the country of France, not only to the French ethnie. The same is true in the Slovak case. So, will you now remove the "disputed" tag or you have any other problem with this article? [[User:Tankred\|Tankred]] 16:22, 4 January 2007 (UTC)		::The words "Slovak" and "Slovakian" are synonyms and their use in the article's name does not necessarily imply ethnicity (as I explained in the article's lead). Compare with similar adjectives, such as "French" (i.e. "Of, relating to, or characteristic of France or its people or culture."). In the category French nobility, you can find nobles who died before France was even created as well as nobles of German or Catalan ethnicity. Why? Because the word "French" relates to the country of France, not only to the French ethnie. The same is true in the Slovak case. So, will you now remove the "disputed" tag or you have any other problem with this article? [[User:Tankred\|Tankred]] 16:22, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

			''"Slovak - adj. Of or relating to Slovakia or its people, language, or culture."'' Slovakia exists since 1991. If you want, we can say between 1938-45 and since 1991. It can not be connected to a that time non existed country, wich was BTW that time was called as Upper Hungary, or Highlands. This is a creation. Maybe read again what I wrote a bit upper. This page can not be a territorial list, max an ethnic one, I changed its tontent to fit for this. It is funny too, since there's no [[Essexian noble families]], but [[English noble families]] Not to mention that some of them had nothing to do with the culture or the ppl (ok, except their peasants and employees), just lived there, or had lands there. OFF:And we know, that nobles very very barely mixed with ppl of lower rank, and those kids were not granted to enter the nobility. --[[User:VinceB\|Vince]] <sup>[[user talk:VinceB\|hey, yo!]] :-)</sup> 18:45, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Tankred: /* What is this supposed to mean? */ This is just your misunderstanding of the word "Slovak"

2007-01-04T16:22:48Z

What is this supposed to mean?: This is just your misunderstanding of the word "Slovak"

← Previous revision		Revision as of 16:22, 4 January 2007
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	:BTW: According t your logic, none of the edits should be removed, and for example [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Great_Moravia&diff=prev&oldid=98253579 this] is a vandalism made by you, by deleting quotations, no matter, that in fact that anon's edit was the vandalism... --[[User:VinceB\|Vince]] <sup>[[user talk:VinceB\|hey, yo!]] :-)</sup> 00:26, 4 January 2007 (UTC)		:BTW: According t your logic, none of the edits should be removed, and for example [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Great_Moravia&diff=prev&oldid=98253579 this] is a vandalism made by you, by deleting quotations, no matter, that in fact that anon's edit was the vandalism... --[[User:VinceB\|Vince]] <sup>[[user talk:VinceB\|hey, yo!]] :-)</sup> 00:26, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

			::Now I see that your vandalism (blanking most of an article) was unintentional, caused by your misunderstanding of the word "Slovak". If you have troubles understanding English, please, use a dictionary. I recommend for example an excellent American Heritage Dictionary. I will copy a line from it for you:
			::"Slovak - adj. Of or relating to Slovakia or its people, language, or culture."
			::The words "Slovak" and "Slovakian" are synonyms and their use in the article's name does not necessarily imply ethnicity (as I explained in the article's lead). Compare with similar adjectives, such as "French" (i.e. "Of, relating to, or characteristic of France or its people or culture."). In the category French nobility, you can find nobles who died before France was even created as well as nobles of German or Catalan ethnicity. Why? Because the word "French" relates to the country of France, not only to the French ethnie. The same is true in the Slovak case. So, will you now remove the "disputed" tag or you have any other problem with this article? [[User:Tankred\|Tankred]] 16:22, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

VinceB: /* What is this supposed to mean? */

2007-01-04T00:30:59Z

What is this supposed to mean?

← Previous revision		Revision as of 00:30, 4 January 2007
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	And: Slovakia exist since 1991, so "Slovakian noble families" would be a creation. A thing, wich never existed. So, restricting to only the Slovak nobles, or deleteing this article would be the right thing. --[[User:VinceB\|Vince]] <sup>[[user talk:VinceB\|hey, yo!]] :-)</sup> 00:26, 4 January 2007 (UTC)		And: Slovakia exist since 1991, so "Slovakian noble families" would be a creation. A thing, wich never existed. So, restricting to only the Slovak nobles, or deleteing this article would be the right thing. --[[User:VinceB\|Vince]] <sup>[[user talk:VinceB\|hey, yo!]] :-)</sup> 00:26, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

	:BTW: According t your logic, none of the edits should be removed, and for example [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Great_Moravia&diff=prev&oldid=98253579 this] is a vandalism made by you, by deleting quotations. --[[User:VinceB\|Vince]] <sup>[[user talk:VinceB\|hey, yo!]] :-)</sup> 00:26, 4 January 2007 (UTC)		:BTW: According t your logic, none of the edits should be removed, and for example [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Great_Moravia&diff=prev&oldid=98253579 this] is a vandalism made by you, by deleting quotations, no matter, that in fact that anon's edit was the vandalism... --[[User:VinceB\|Vince]] <sup>[[user talk:VinceB\|hey, yo!]] :-)</sup> 00:26, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

VinceB at 00:27, 4 January 2007

2007-01-04T00:27:40Z

← Previous revision		Revision as of 00:27, 4 January 2007
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	:What? This list exists since August 2005. Now you are trying to blank it and you call me a vandal? Stop abusing vandalism warning templates! They will not give you any extra credibility. If you read the lead of this article, you will find out that this is not a list of "ethnic Slovaks". This list includes nobles who were born in the territory of Slovakia, lived there, built castles there, died there, are buried there... are part of history of that country. What exactly is wrong with that? I really doubt that Palatine Amade Aba in the 14th century held any particular ethnic identity. He clearly spoke Latin and he was formally a vassal of the King of Hungary who was Italian of French origins himself. So, in which list should we include the Amade family? Territorial identities and kinship were more important for medieval Europeans than ethnicity. This is a territorial list, not an ethnic one. [[User:Tankred\|Tankred]] 23:51, 3 January 2007 (UTC)		:What? This list exists since August 2005. Now you are trying to blank it and you call me a vandal? Stop abusing vandalism warning templates! They will not give you any extra credibility. If you read the lead of this article, you will find out that this is not a list of "ethnic Slovaks". This list includes nobles who were born in the territory of Slovakia, lived there, built castles there, died there, are buried there... are part of history of that country. What exactly is wrong with that? I really doubt that Palatine Amade Aba in the 14th century held any particular ethnic identity. He clearly spoke Latin and he was formally a vassal of the King of Hungary who was Italian of French origins himself. So, in which list should we include the Amade family? Territorial identities and kinship were more important for medieval Europeans than ethnicity. This is a territorial list, not an ethnic one. [[User:Tankred\|Tankred]] 23:51, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

	:Wow, what a reason. ''"This list exists since August 2005"''. Is it really a reason why should that false content be kept? Of course: NO. If you read my comments above, you'll realize, that you again (as always) does not reflect to my problem, but try to turn this discussion into some funny way, where you prove that I'm a nationalist vandal, wich is pretty ridicuolus, since you always fail with it, because I'm not. Simply cutting back creationism, as can be seen here.		Wow, what a reason. ''"This list exists since August 2005"''. Is it really a reason why should that false content be kept? Of course: NO. If you read my comments above, you'll realize, that you again (as always) does not reflect to my problem, but try to turn this discussion into some funny way, where you prove that I'm a nationalist vandal, wich is pretty ridicuolus, since you always fail with it, because I'm not. Simply cutting back creationism, as can be seen here.

	:I really really do not know, how and when will I be able to somehow convince you to at least once talk about the topic, instead of trying to prove your fixed ideas on me.		I really really do not know, how and when will I be able to somehow convince you to at least once talk about the topic, instead of trying to prove your fixed ideas on me.

	:'''My problem again, with big letters, hoping to reach you:''' <big>Article name: '''SLOVAK''' not slovakian! NOBLE FAMILIES</big>. Got it? The list should contain the ''Slovak'' noble families, not all the ''Slovaki'''''an''''' noble families. Got it? Big difference. This page is '''''not''''' a territorial list.		'''My problem again, with big letters, hoping to reach you:''' <big>Article name: '''SLOVAK''' not slovakian! NOBLE FAMILIES</big>. Got it? The list should contain the ''Slovak'' noble families, not all the ''Slovaki'''''an''''' noble families. Got it? Big difference. This page is '''''not''''' a territorial list.

	And: Slovakia exist since 1991, so "Slovakian noble families" would be a creation. A thing, wich never existed. So, restricting to only the Slovak nobles, or deleteing this article would be the right thing. --[[User:VinceB\|Vince]] <sup>[[user talk:VinceB\|hey, yo!]] :-)</sup> 00:26, 4 January 2007 (UTC)		And: Slovakia exist since 1991, so "Slovakian noble families" would be a creation. A thing, wich never existed. So, restricting to only the Slovak nobles, or deleteing this article would be the right thing. --[[User:VinceB\|Vince]] <sup>[[user talk:VinceB\|hey, yo!]] :-)</sup> 00:26, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

VinceB: fixa ideas vs topic. My problem again, with some visual help, to find and understand it

2007-01-04T00:26:38Z

fixa ideas vs topic. My problem again, with some visual help, to find and understand it

← Previous revision		Revision as of 00:26, 4 January 2007
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	:What? This list exists since August 2005. Now you are trying to blank it and you call me a vandal? Stop abusing vandalism warning templates! They will not give you any extra credibility. If you read the lead of this article, you will find out that this is not a list of "ethnic Slovaks". This list includes nobles who were born in the territory of Slovakia, lived there, built castles there, died there, are buried there... are part of history of that country. What exactly is wrong with that? I really doubt that Palatine Amade Aba in the 14th century held any particular ethnic identity. He clearly spoke Latin and he was formally a vassal of the King of Hungary who was Italian of French origins himself. So, in which list should we include the Amade family? Territorial identities and kinship were more important for medieval Europeans than ethnicity. This is a territorial list, not an ethnic one. [[User:Tankred\|Tankred]] 23:51, 3 January 2007 (UTC)		:What? This list exists since August 2005. Now you are trying to blank it and you call me a vandal? Stop abusing vandalism warning templates! They will not give you any extra credibility. If you read the lead of this article, you will find out that this is not a list of "ethnic Slovaks". This list includes nobles who were born in the territory of Slovakia, lived there, built castles there, died there, are buried there... are part of history of that country. What exactly is wrong with that? I really doubt that Palatine Amade Aba in the 14th century held any particular ethnic identity. He clearly spoke Latin and he was formally a vassal of the King of Hungary who was Italian of French origins himself. So, in which list should we include the Amade family? Territorial identities and kinship were more important for medieval Europeans than ethnicity. This is a territorial list, not an ethnic one. [[User:Tankred\|Tankred]] 23:51, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

			:Wow, what a reason. ''"This list exists since August 2005"''. Is it really a reason why should that false content be kept? Of course: NO. If you read my comments above, you'll realize, that you again (as always) does not reflect to my problem, but try to turn this discussion into some funny way, where you prove that I'm a nationalist vandal, wich is pretty ridicuolus, since you always fail with it, because I'm not. Simply cutting back creationism, as can be seen here.

			:I really really do not know, how and when will I be able to somehow convince you to at least once talk about the topic, instead of trying to prove your fixed ideas on me.

			:'''My problem again, with big letters, hoping to reach you:''' <big>Article name: '''SLOVAK''' not slovakian! NOBLE FAMILIES</big>. Got it? The list should contain the ''Slovak'' noble families, not all the ''Slovaki'''''an''''' noble families. Got it? Big difference. This page is '''''not''''' a territorial list.

			And: Slovakia exist since 1991, so "Slovakian noble families" would be a creation. A thing, wich never existed. So, restricting to only the Slovak nobles, or deleteing this article would be the right thing. --[[User:VinceB\|Vince]] <sup>[[user talk:VinceB\|hey, yo!]] :-)</sup> 00:26, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

			:BTW: According t your logic, none of the edits should be removed, and for example [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Great_Moravia&diff=prev&oldid=98253579 this] is a vandalism made by you, by deleting quotations. --[[User:VinceB\|Vince]] <sup>[[user talk:VinceB\|hey, yo!]] :-)</sup> 00:26, 4 January 2007 (UTC)